heel and toe


Kozy said:
If you did it right (i.e. not locking up, over-revving etc) you'd have to get a right arsehole of a copper to have something to say about it. And if he's that big a wanker, it's probably worth nutting him.
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:lol:

Best advice ever! :D
 
Mattharvey12 said:
cant do this properly, it feels smoother for me if i dont do heel and toe.
i guess the d14 isnt hardcore enough lol
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My lil fiesta loves it ;) and d14 is a lil more hardcore than that.
Its a bit easier when you've mastered rev matching normally, then adding the braking in at a later date. I got shot down for asking about heel toe and rev matching on the fiesta forum :(. Cuz everyone on UKFN is a road angel! hence why every other week one of the members has a new conviction, hehe.
 
Not much need to toe and heel in FWD cars though (only to save engine wear). RWD cars are crucial for it however, as it will prevent the rears from 'locking up' in the snag of the down-shift. Thus making cornering smoother and more accurate. Giving a ma-hoosive advantage over anyone who can't do it. But to be fair, anyone racing long circuit knows how to do it, and once you've done a session practicing it, it becomes like a second nature after that :win:
 
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i love this technique, i can do it near perfect every time now! with a bit of practise its easily possible. makes driving so much more fun, especially the early hours of the morning :naughty:
 
Ha, it's good for showing off to your mates too! Lol, trying to teach the Mrs. How to do it!! :lol:
 
Type-R-Ste said:
Not much need to toe and heel in FWD cars though (only to save engine wear).
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Not true, you can still lock up the front wheels on a car without abs. During hard braking I tried to down change without heal and toe at Rockingham and my front wheels just locked up.
 
First of all, that's why I said not "MUCH" point, and secondly, you're clearly down-shifting FAR too early if it's that bad, trust me, good drivers don't toe and heel FWD series...
 
so your saying the race drivers that test race ek9s and stuff are **** drivers because im pretty damn sure 99.9% heel and toe
 
Surely it's just as important in a FWD from a racing perspective of making cornering 'smoother and more accurate'?... If not, someone should tell all those famous, professional, Japanese racing-drivers they've been doing it wrong all these years. :p
 
Championship White said:
Surely it's just as important in a FWD from a racing perspective of making cornering 'smoother and more accurate'?... If not, someone should tell all those famous, professional, Japanese racing-drivers they've been doing it wrong all these years. :p
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this is a better way to put what i said lol
 
Did I say anything about what they do in Japan? No, did I say any of them were ****? No, I'm saying there's not "MUCH NEED" to toe and heel in FWD cars if you can change gear at the right time, which isn't hard! The "famous Japanese drivers" that you quaintly put, WILL toe and heel all the time, in everything, because 99.9% of the time, they're in RWD/4WD cars! (Skylines, Evo's ect)... Yea, it is possible to do it, but if you can change gear at the correct time, you don't need to! Champ White, can I ask what you race long circuit?
 
Look mate it's an internet forum, there's no need to jump out of your pram. And since it's the internet I could say I'm the Stig himself and you'd be hard pressed to prove otherwise. All I was asking was for you to qualify your opinion... which was the only reason to heel-toe in a FWD was to save engine wear:

Not much need to toe and heel in FWD cars though (only to save engine wear).
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I could understand if you were to say it wasn't quite as vital since, when breaking in a RWD car the weight distribution moves towards the front and and away from the driven wheels and so a clumpy gear change could cause an unintentional drift whereas the weight distribution sits on the driven wheels of a FWD and so a clumpy gear change will effect it less - which would be my assumption - but you didn't bother giving a reason. I would still imagine that heel-toe would be of more benefit than to reduce engine wear in a FWD though, just as Internman experienced.
 
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I didn't bother giving a reason because I'm clearly talking to a person who has absolutely NO racing experience what so ever! And congratulations, you can do research! Yes, this is an internet forum, so why is it that you insist on 'slagging' EVERYTHING people post on here?! Like this, the badge thing on my EK9 pics, and that guys ride with the hydraulics? If you've got nothing nice to say, then don't say it! Grow up and stop being such a whopper!
 
You need to lighten up a bit, I wasn't being malicious. Since I'm not a racing driver I was asking a question about something I don't know much about, sure I did poke fun a bit in my own ignorance, but more fool me for doing that, and when I thought about the answer to my question it turned out you were mostly right with what you said, even if it wasn't explained. I'm not intentionally trying to be a whopper even if I am being one. And I'm sorry I made a joke about the badge, it was only posted in jest.
 
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Type-R-Ste said:
I didn't bother giving a reason because I'm clearly talking to a person who has absolutely NO racing experience what so ever! And congratulations, you can do research! Yes, this is an internet forum, so why is it that you insist on 'slagging' EVERYTHING people post on here?! Like this, the badge thing on my EK9 pics, and that guys ride with the hydraulics? If you've got nothing nice to say, then don't say it! Grow up and stop being such a whopper!
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Mate, you really need to chill out a bit. I've just read all your posts on the page above and regardless of what anyone else has said your responses have been needlessly sarcastic, immature and unwarranted.

We all get along here, so please just try and accept each member as they are. Most of us are inquisitive and will question anything we don't agree with or understand, I think that comes as part and parcel with the kind of people that find themselves attracted to the EK9.

Understand that your reactions are only making you stand out as unreasonable.
 
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As JB eloquently put, none of us, including me, mean any harm. It's all too easy to read into something in a post that wasn't intended by the writer; which is why smilies were invented. I always use good ol' 'smiling face with tongue out' to show I don't mean any harm, it's by far the most useful of all the smilies :p
 
Type-R-Ste said:
First of all, that's why I said not "MUCH" point, and secondly, you're clearly down-shifting FAR too early if it's that bad, trust me, good drivers don't toe and heel FWD series...
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I was shifting at the same point as when I was changing down with heal and toe. I only tried to down change without doing h + t as a test as I didn't believe it could lock up :p.

Yeah, you don't need to heal and toe to down shift as I know a few people who don't. I think it just depends on the driving style.
 
Champ White; Ok sound, that's fair enough and I appreciate your honesty :) I joined here to get a bit of advice myself on stuff I don't know much about, it's just I don't get why people post horrible crap sometimes that's all. (Or stuff that comes across as horrible at first). I toe and heel myself in the 9 on the road, adds to the driving experience, lol. It's just that I meant not all FWD series toe and heel as there's not much of a need to. I used to race in the Ginetta series (among other things) and I had to toe and heel in that as it was RWD, lol :)

Jokeshop; that's all well and good, however If I feel someone is being malicious towards anything I'm saying, I'm going to defend my point, but whatever. At the end of the day, like I've said, I just want to get on with people on here and exchange good facts and info with them, not get into arguments!

Interman; yeah, that's sound man, it's just that when you're not toe and heeling, it's best you get the gear changes in as late and as quick as possible, reducing the cars speed to what it needs to be for the corner, rather than changing... waiting... then changing again, the more spaced out your down-shifts are, the worse the effect on your cornering (sharpness/ smoothness), and you'll find out your lap times aren't as consistent :)
 
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