Why A B16b Rather Than B18c In The EK9?

[689R]

OK updated it. Closest I can get it is 180bhp at 8300rpm for the B16B and 195bhp at 8000rpm for the B18C.

Chuck your weight values and gear ratios in and see how the two engines would compare. The wheel torque chart cuts off in the lower gears where wheel spin would occur.

The engine controls are a bit crude I know, but it's only an educational resource, not a professional lap time simulation.

And in fairness, it does look like the B18C with a 98 Spec box puts down a fair whack more torque to the wheels, which would indeed give you some traction issues in a light car.

this calculator is very sick

 

[Kozy]

this calculator is very sick

Cheers mate. Had a look at the Honda braking one on there?

Rinnaye, if you're having issues with getting any results out of it, can I ask what browser you are viewing it on?

It's only really been tested on desktops using Chrome or Firefox, it's not compatible with IE and is a bit clunky on mobile devices.

You should be able to change a value, hit enter and it will update.

 

[rinnaye]

MacBook Pro, running iOs Mountain Lion.

When I first checked, the site would at least populate results with values, but this last time, it didn't even return any values.

I'll keep at it.

 

[Escy]

Pretty sure it's for tax reasons in Japan. Toyota had the 1.6 20v 4AGE, Nissan the SR16VE, Mitsubishi had the Mivec 4G92. All 1600cc with over 100bhp per litre. None of these engines made it out of Japan.

 

[kellsled]

Most likely as the Dc2 is a heavier car and to have a different engine than the ek9 for different racing classes and sales reasons

my lightweight version weighed 1060kg standard,wasnt down to the weight

 

[Kozy]

MacBook Pro, running iOs Mountain Lion.

When I first checked, the site would at least populate results with values, but this last time, it didn't even return any values.

I'll keep at it.

I have absolutely no idea about that then I am afraid. Will have to look into it, thanks for flagging it up.

 

[rinnaye]

Pretty sure it's for tax reasons in Japan. Toyota had the 1.6 20v 4AGE, Nissan the SR16VE, Mitsubishi had the Mivec 4G92. All 1600cc with over 100bhp per litre. None of these engines made it out of Japan.

Care to explain this in a bit more detail? I'm curious to know why any car manufacturer would be motivated to produce a variant of one of their other automobile engines based on tax regulations. Especially given both versions are still classified in the 4 cylinder category. I'd perhaps be more inclined to think most car manufacturers produced engines, and ultimately vehicles in general, based primarily on consumer demand, but I could stand to be corrected.

Hope I don't sound completely dim witted.

 

[iceman]

you wont get a precise answer to original question as all hearsay and guessing but interesting theories

only people that know the answer is the business and marketing guys that worked at honda the years they produced them and most likely guys that designed the 2 cars

in terms of character very different engines and my preferred choice is the b16b, have soft spot for it (yes the b18 produces more bhp/torque and would make ek9 quicker)

 

[Kozy]

Care to explain this in a bit more detail? I'm curious to know why any car manufacturer would be motivated to produce a variant of one of their other automobile engines based on tax regulations. Especially given both versions are still classified in the 4 cylinder category. I'd perhaps be more inclined to think most car manufacturers produced engines, and ultimately vehicles in general, based primarily on consumer demand, but I could stand to be corrected.

Hope I don't sound completely dim witted.

That's not that uncommon. The Germans had a tax class for cars over 200bhp so many were limited to just under.

In Spain they had a punative tax on cars over 2 litres so BMW did an E30 for them that was basically a destroked M3 in a Sport body, called the 320iS.

 

[nfspeedy]

That's not that uncommon. The Germans had a tax class for cars over 200bhp so many were limited to just under.

where did you heared that?

I know of a registration law in romania. Thats pretty the same as the law in japan to make cars with bigger engines than 1600 more expensive in taxing.

by the way good discussion here

 

[rinnaye]

That's not that uncommon. The Germans had a tax class for cars over 200bhp so many were limited to just under.

In Spain they had a punative tax on cars over 2 litres so BMW did an E30 for them that was basically a destroked M3 in a Sport body, called the 320iS.

Makes perfectly good sense.

Us yanks do have something similar in the form of "Luxury" Tax on vehicles costing more than a certain amount, and we also have a "gas guzzler" Tax as well, but neither of those taxes applied to the engine specifications, but I can see how a State's Government could very well levy a tax on horsepower, if they chose to do so, and in some cases, it seems they have.

Thanks,

 

[Escy]

Care to explain this in a bit more detail? I'm curious to know why any car manufacturer would be motivated to produce a variant of one of their other automobile engines based on tax regulations. Especially given both versions are still classified in the 4 cylinder category. I'd perhaps be more inclined to think most car manufacturers produced engines, and ultimately vehicles in general, based primarily on consumer demand, but I could stand to be corrected.

Hope I don't sound completely dim witted.

It happens all the time in Japan. Have you not heard of Kei cars before?

Kei car - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[rinnaye]

Update:

Well all, I thought I'd give everyone an update, after having fitted the B16b in to my vintage Si, and running it for a couple of weeks.

While my overall opinion seems to be generally positive, the car having a considerable amount more pull in just about every rpm range, and especially wild in the upper rpm's, I am indeed impressed, and would say, this swap was worth it in total. The B16b in such a light weight chassis absolutely rips.

The only noticeable downside I find is the B16b seems to have a bit of lag while under hard acceleration, and this happens only between the rpm's 3000 to 4000. I also have a higher than usual idle on average, due to a vacuum leak somewhere perhaps, and I suspect both problems to be in relation. I went with a full 2.25 piping, and new Magnaflow muffler, which is nice, but still that nagging lag in power/acceleration while running through all gears 1st-4th wot. After 4000 rpm's she screams all the way to hell. lol!

Any ideas, suggestions, comments pertaining to what may be causing this lag, and what I should do to address it, or is this just inherent with the 1.6 B-series engines?

It should also be noted that I've yet to change out the spark plugs, cap, rotor, and wires. These parts are now ordered, and'll be arriving later this week for installation.

Thanks in advance.

Rene

 

[nfspeedy]

That should be normal. I notice a dynamic impulse after 4500 rpm in my D-series Civic coupe because the lambda-control is turning of by the ecu

 

[Avetec]

both are bomb proof engines but i'd rather buy a b16b and spend the money on proper gear ratios..would make up for the lost torque and be a blast to drive.

 

[stevenEK9]

both are bomb proof engines but i'd rather buy a b16b and spend the money on proper gear ratios..would make up for the lost torque and be a blast to drive.

not true - the B16B technically has the more sound block, with the smaller rod to stroke ratio it puts less lateral forces on the cylinder walls, hence there are less smokey B16B's as there are B18C's

B16B's with good gears are ace

EK9 vs GT3 clubsport Nurburgring full lap - YouTube