Oily Carbon Deposit on IM

[JDM 101]

@Blinx ... What brand of oil catch can do you recommend. I always see the very common Cusco & GReddy but they dont have that breather thing on top. What bran is that on you car?

 

[zeff]

so how do you plug these pcv guys?

 

[RagingAngel]

nice blinx9900!
same like edwins set up !
your oil tank is baffled ?
why it must be baffled ?

The tank SHOULD be baffled because the it helps increase the surface area of the inside of the tank so it will catch the oily vapor more effectively. If you do not baffle it - the vacuum source from the other tube basically draws it back into the intake manifold.

@Blinx ... What brand of oil catch can do you recommend. I always see the very common Cusco & GReddy but they dont have that breather thing on top. What bran is that on you car?

I recommend B&R - But what brand doesn't really matter. I've seen people make catchcans out of martini shakers, used engine oil bottles, even tupperware and in a pinch, even aluminum cans work. A filter is not necessary if you wish to vent to atmosphere. You can drill holes... but the holes must be equal if not be more in total surface area than the feeding hose.

so how do you plug these pcv guys?

You don't plug the PCV. For an NA setup you run a barb/tube from where the PCV normally sits and you attach tubing to that barb and run it into the catchcan. This is for a RACE SETUP with NO consideration to emissions.

Otherwise you run the tubing off the PCV into the catchcan and then the exit tubing from catchcan is run back into the intake manifold.


race setup = NO PCV => catchcan => atmosphere (port on IM plugged)

street setup = PCV => catchcan => port on IM

The street setup will obviously still leave some traces of oily deposits inside the IM over time...but the catchcan is now helping filter out as much of it as possible.

 

[SPek9]

Thanks for the info RacingAngel very helpfull. One question I have, would you have any idea how much the emmisions will be increased by using the race setup and removing the pcv valve and plugging the IM? Also would you recommend running the breather from the back of the rocker cover to the catchcan aswell?

do you think that this would cause a car to fail uk mot emmissions tests?

Thanks

 

[JDM 101]

@RA ... That B&R catch can is expensive. I think i'll buy a cheaper catch tank and modify the upper part for the breather.

BTW, maybe what zeff mean was the IM port. What shall we use to plug it?

Also, I read before that you will loss hp when you install just a breather at the back of the rocker cover. Is it true? Will i loss hp too if i bypass the PCV to the IM.




@Blinx ... I noticed a 2 catch can on your car engine bay. What's the 2nd can for? The port on the IM where the PCV hose was supposed to be was attached farther to where. Is it going to the turbo?

 

[RagingAngel]

Thanks for the info RacingAngel very helpfull. One question I have, would you have any idea how much the emmisions will be increased by using the race setup and removing the pcv valve and plugging the IM? Also would you recommend running the breather from the back of the rocker cover to the catchcan aswell?

do you think that this would cause a car to fail uk mot emmissions tests?

Thanks

Unfortunately I do not have the exact figures - but I do know it's borderline if not a guaranteed FAIL under my province's testing facilities. I can only assume that our emissions testing standards are at the very least just as clean as the UK MOT.

I would run the T from the rocker and the PCV into a single line to the catchcan.

example:
-rocker
-> T => catchcan
-PCV

@RA ... That B&R catch can is expensive. I think i'll buy a cheaper catch tank and modify the upper part for the breather.

BTW, maybe what zeff mean was the IM port. What shall we use to plug it?

Also, I read before that you will loss hp when you install just a breather at the back of the rocker cover. Is it true? Will i loss hp too if i bypass the PCV to the IM.

modding an existing can is perfectly fine... maybe I'll do a write-up later on, on how to mod "eBay cans..." errr..or maybe not..haha..anyhow...

The valvecover itself is supposed to draw in air. But because the pressure from the crankcase is so great, oil is forced out of that port and ends up getting sucked into the intake manifold as well along with the OEM PCV port. This is why the PCV race style vent is T'd like I suggested above before it goes into the catchcan.

If you put a filter on the rocker cover, it will be fine if you do not vtec... but once you do and if you do for an extended period of time (track events), you'll more than likely find an oily film all over the motor and under your bonnet.

You can plug the port on the IM with just about anything. Vacuum caps are the proper way to do it. But I've seen people weld it shut, jam bolts in there gooped with sealant etc.

 

[abunai888]

thanks for the informations !

my homemade catch tank im gonna use is made from a spray can 200ml the size of the tank make any difference ?
my set up will be like blinx9900 trough the back ports of engine block.

in race setup case with NO PCV => catchcan => atmosphere (port on IM plugged) the can can be un-baffled right ?
or it will happens the same thing like when install the small filter on the rocker cover ?

 

[JDM 101]

What do you mean by baffled? Does it mean that i have to tear a bnew catch can apart so i can weld a barrier in it? So for being a noob in this. I was really not into this oil catch can thing until i saw what was inside my car's IM.

 

[JDM 101]

@RA ... I will going for the race set up since our emission law here is not so strict. From what i understand is i will need the following:

- oil catch tank with bigger hose
- T for the PCV & valve cover port
- modifiy a breather for the catch tank
- plug the IM side of the PCV hose

Did I missed something?

About the HP loss, is it true?

 

[RagingAngel]

thanks for the informations !

my homemade catch tank im gonna use is made from a spray can 200ml the size of the tank make any difference ?
my set up will be like blinx9900 trough the back ports of engine block.

in race setup case with NO PCV => catchcan => atmosphere (port on IM plugged) the can can be un-baffled right ?
or it will happens the same thing like when install the small filter on the rocker cover ?

What do you mean by baffled? Does it mean that i have to tear a bnew catch can apart so i can weld a barrier in it? So for being a noob in this. I was really not into this oil catch can thing until i saw what was inside my car's IM.

certain racing regulations stipulate that you must run at least 1000ml for a catchcan - the obvious reason for doing so is that so it hopefully won't overflow for the duration of the race.

I know on the original setup that I saw on the Spoon cars, the drain for the can ran to the back the car and into a sponge. That sponge would get saturated and would slowly drip during the duration of the race. Personally I don't think this is a good alternative, but I can see the validity of trying to the oil as clean as possible and 1000ml or not, it's probably going to get filled sometime during a 24 hour enduro - unless you run drainback system into the motor.

For baffling, this is why it's important to buy a catchcan that you can open up. This for example is from Megan Racing and would be my choice if I had to modify an "eBay can."

No need to weld inside, just run slash cut tubing from the feeding port to the very bottom of the can and then fill the can with stainless steel scrubbers...NOT stainless wool. Scrubbers will unlikely come apart whereas the wool is so fine, your motor is likely to inhale them IF you run it back to the IM port.

If it's venting to atmosphere, you could fill it with almost anything, as long as it's resistant to oil and won't break apart.

@RA ... I will going for the race set up since our emission law here is not so strict. From what i understand is i will need the following:

- oil catch tank with bigger hose
- T for the PCV & valve cover port
- modifiy a breather for the catch tank
- plug the IM side of the PCV hose

Did I missed something?

About the HP loss, is it true?

You've got everything you need for a decent race only PCV setup. The loss in power is not something I've ever come across.

 

[zeff]

"If you put a filter on the rocker cover, it will be fine if you do not vtec... but once you do and if you do for an extended period of time (track events), you'll more than likely find an oily film all over the motor and under your bonnet."

so thats why i got a big ass oil stain under my hood.

@RA bear with me coz i dont know if im talking with sense or nonsense



we sometimes do drag race here; and my idea is that before going to race i'll plug the IM part pcv marked in (1) and the one marked in (2) ill run the OEM tube going to a "container". would that be o.k? or i'm jaz talking silly..and while in there to avoid the stain under my hood; i'll run a tube from the breather of the rocker cover to the "container" or a separate "container" for it.

my idea of container is an 2" 1/2 inch of tube pipe or 3".

p.s: jdm101 hope you dont mind if used one of your uploaded image and modified it a bit..(pls do tell me if you mind and i will remove it ASAP)

hope im not talking jibberish here

 

[RagingAngel]

zeff it's perfectly fine to do so...

 

[zeff]

zeff it's perfectly fine to do so...

thanx RA

 

[SPek9]

I have one other question for RacingAngel if you don't mind: If I connect the oem pcv line and the rocker breather line with a T into one line this will connect to the catch can, most catch cans have two ports on top to connect lines to so what do I use the other port for? Would it not make more sense to connect the pcv and rocker line separately to each of the two ports on the catch can or was the T method just to tidy things up?

Thanks again

 

[blinx9900]

nice blinx9900!
same like edwins set up !
your oil tank is baffled ?
why it must be baffled ?

not baffled. when you say baffle i am assuming you are referring to plates being welded in on the inside of the can, this is to keep oil from sloshing out of the filter.

@Blinx ... What brand of oil catch can do you recommend. I always see the very common Cusco & GReddy but they dont have that breather thing on top. What bran is that on you car?

I bought a generic one and modified it to have the filter and a -10 on the bottom

The tank SHOULD be baffled because the it helps increase the surface area of the inside of the tank so it will catch the oily vapor more effectively. If you do not baffle it - the vacuum source from the other tube basically draws it back into the intake manifold.

wow wow wow, i think you are misunderstanding my setup, i do not have a vacuum source, nothing goes to my IM sans my bov and boost controller. My can drains back, the last thing i want is a pile of steel wool that has sludge all over it coming in contact with clean oil that is going back into my engine. The only baffle i would use would be to cut mine open and weld steel plates to keep the oil from sloshing out the top when under boost, my charge pipe gets oily sometimes because of this.

 

[RagingAngel]

I have one other question for RacingAngel if you don't mind: If I connect the oem pcv line and the rocker breather line with a T into one line this will connect to the catch can, most catch cans have two ports on top to connect lines to so what do I use the other port for? Would it not make more sense to connect the pcv and rocker line separately to each of the two ports on the catch can or was the T method just to tidy things up?

Thanks again

It's perfectly fine to run individual lines to their respective inlets on the can. The Tee method is just to keep things tidy so there's not a bunch of lines running around.

wow wow wow, i think you are misunderstanding my setup,

No misunderstanding...though the original question was directed to you.. I'm answering merely in the sense for those who are looking to run a street oriented, emissions compliant setup.

 

[SPek9]

It's perfectly fine to run individual lines to their respective inlets on the can. The Tee method is just to keep things tidy so there's not a bunch of lines running around.

Thanks for the advice bud

 

[abunai888]

@blinx9900 what fittings have you used on the back of your engine block ?
are they difficult to find these on autozone ?

 

[blinx9900]

No misunderstanding...though the original question was directed to you.. I'm answering merely in the sense for those who are looking to run a street oriented, emissions compliant setup.

oh okay that's fine, it just looked like you were answering for me

@blinx9900 what fittings have you used on the back of your engine block ?
are they difficult to find these on autozone ?

hmmm, not sure if you can find them there, i order form Honda, they are OEM prelude parts, if you google prelude block port part number it should come up...

 

[abunai888]

thanks blinx9900 !
i'll try internet !