H2B Discussion

[AzAc54]

Alright guys, ive seen alot on the subject of H2B swaps lately, just thought id ask out of interest the pro's and con's or this swap? anyone had any experience with it? Fire away

 

[pedro_rallye]

pros are more torque and thats about it really

you can argue you have a 2.2 base if you ever wanted to go the big bhp FI route but personally this isnt a pro

cons are plentiful, old engine, a lot of hassle, heavier engine to name a few

if youre looking to ditch the b-series only do it for a K20...

if you have enough of a budget though the H-series can be very handy, ask Rich at PA...

 

[Ernie]

I disagree, the engine itself is only very slightly heavier than a B series, its the H series box that is heavy, when using the B box there is very little in it, certainly not enough to notice.

Pros-

Cheap, especially if you dont do it with an off the shelf kit. easily half the price of K swap. H22a7 can be had for under a grand easily.
Big torque and power easily (230 - 250 with boltons and cams).
Simple enough swap in an EK chassis, no welding or wiring hassle.

Cons -

High mileage engines as getting old
They dont like boost (if thats the way you wanna go)

For me, you cant argue with the bhp per pound you get....

 

[DuncanB]

I've been toying with the Idea of a H2b swap. I agree with ernie on all his pro's and con's, the only con I would like to add is the one that has put me off it, and that is the H series engine doesnt rev like a B series! perhaps a B18 cant make 230hp as easily but a 200hp B18 would be more fun to drive than a H I'm sure.

Also I have heard that you need to run them slighlty overfilled with oil because of the angle the engine sits at, something about it pulling oil away from the oil pickup.

 

[Ernie]

I've been toying with the Idea of a H2b swap. I agree with ernie on all his pro's and con's, the only con I would like to add is the one that has put me off it, and that is the H series engine doesnt rev like a B series! perhaps a B18 cant make 230hp as easily but a 200hp B18 would be more fun to drive than a H I'm sure.

Also I have heard that you need to run them slighlty overfilled with oil because of the angle the engine sits at, something about it pulling oil away from the oil pickup.

There is a sump available that solves this BUT if you do it the way my mates have without using a kit, it sits exactly as a B series engine does, so its not a problem.

As for it not reving as well, I'm not sure about that, my old ATR felt just as fun as any civics I've owned, ok its no screaming b16, but even in that heavy chassis if felt great... The torque more than makes up for it....

 

[kulo]

Im going h2b end of the year
h22a7 atr motor with s80 4.7fd
Will be about 250hp 180tq
only problem will be traction lol

 

[Ernie]

Im going h2b end of the year
h22a7 atr motor with s80 4.7fd
Will be about 250hp 180tq
only problem will be traction lol

My mate has JDM h22a with 4.7 s80 and Quaife in an EF8, no kit, bonnet clears, good ground clearance, just had to trim headlight to clear alt and machine crank pulley down....

I'm yet to have a ride in it tho... (

 

[alan168]

the cons i found where with my mates one, with the kits, is that they aint cheap, import only and the engine sits real close to the chassis rail
aside from that it was as fast as my mates 250hp k20 dc2

 

[t3gav]

Do the B series boxes bolt straight onto the H blocks then? Do they share any other similarities?

 

[StevieG]

They don't bolt straight up, you need an adaptor plate to fit the b series box.
Also a flywheel spacer unless you buy the h2b flywheel which is already machined to suit.
I have a h2b eg that I made all the mounts, adaptor plate and spacer for.
Just made a mate one for his h2b ef aswel.

 

[Cutz]

evening guys,

after years of owning a H22 I can safely say that you don't realise the power and potency of this engine until you actually drive it.

I've had K20's, never been impressed with the high vtec point & lack of torque and can certainly say in standard form the H22 will dick all over it.
I know the question always comes round to weight and yes, the H22 is a bit heavier but it's not until you check the figures that you realise there isn't that much in it.

check out Honda Tuning Magazine's Hasport feature: Honda Engine And Drivetrain Weights Guide - Honda Tuning Magazine

they compare the engine, gearbox and drivetrains of the most popular engines and you can compare for yourself, there's really not that much in it.

The H22 engines themselves are absolutely bullet proof, i've just rebuilt a 100,000mile '94 H22 engine and she was perfect inside, i simply chose to renew all the seals, shells, rings and all the other major service items for a full refresh. she was still even on her original head gasket! as you know if you crank up the power loads you will come into problems but if you source the right parts it can all be achieved.

I did the full H22A conversion, fitting cable shifters and converting my EJ9 OBD2 to OBD1, I didn't want any issues trying to locate civic parts for somekind of frankenstein conversion...i wanted to drop everything from the prelude straight in.

the M2B4 LSD prelude gearbox I use is absolutely fantastic and have used it many times in the past. the gearing is excellent, boxes are pretty strong and in my much heavily 93 prelude that engine and box combo got me to a confirmed 155mph+ with plenty of revs to spare.

However, the issues arise when you attempt a H2B conversion, the engine sits at an iffy angle making exhausts more complicated, clearance issues and all sorts of other little problems.

I'm extremely glad I went for the full H22A and prelude M2B4 gearbox, I missed my prelude so much...the H22 really got under my skin and not even owning a high powered turbo evo straight after could make me forget it and NEED to own another one.

 

[JDM_Dan]

I used to own a JDM DC2 obviously with the B18C and then the K24 in an Accord Type S and now I have a H22 Euro R.

The B18 really reminds you of how fun a Honda is to drive and the rev range is perfect and so free revving.

The K24 felt really strong but didnt really excite you too much, Vtec was also really dim. The gearbox was its real strong point though and maybe one of the only factors I miss of the K24.

Now I have a H22, in comparison to both the B18c and the K24 it feels really lazy and quite held back in standard form. Vtec is prominant though. Gearbox isnt the best but it is adequate and alot better than many other gearboxes on other cars. With a few breathing mods the H22 opens up and its only been recently ive started to appreciate the H22 properly.

Its a hard choice as to which engine I would prefer now, when I first got the Euro R I thought the B18c with a K 6 speed gearbox was the best route, but now the H22 has taken hold of me!

I beleive once I have got my 5.15 final drive, Carbon Synchro, L&B flywheel then this will become my favourite engine and gearbox although it isnt in standard form.

In basic standard form the B18c is the one. With mods, the H. For forced induction the K.

 

[Cutz]

^^^ definately agree with you there, a few choice breathing mods, lose the cat, lightweight flywheel and she comes alive!

 

[Karleg6]

I've a h2b eg6 for track and drag use and the odd bit of road.. Have had h22 eg's for the past two years..

Started out with h22a and m2b4 box from jdm bb4 prelude.. Was 199bhp and 171ft lbs torque.. Then changed to h22a7 engine and u2q7 box from accord type r. Was 221.7bhp and 168ft lbs torque..

Didn't like the cable gear box at all.. The gear change was **** and especially drag racing it was real ****. The u2q7 was rebuilt when I bought it and after 6 months of use it was notching going into 5th.. Then drag racing end of last year I snapped a gear cable so that was the final straw for me.

I went and bought a h2b kit from the states. I picked up a Plm kit and a Plm drag style manifold suited for the h2b kit. I got a full custom made 70mm exhaust from manifold back and 3" intake arm on a Blox v stack.. I've only had it to one drag day this year and had issues with my pressure plate so I wasn't able to change gear high in revs at all but still ran 13.3-13.5 consistent for the day..

I've sorted my pressure plate issue since and the car feels way way better than it did before with the u2q7 cable box. I'm using a 4.4 s80 but hoping to swap to a 4.7 in the next few weeks.

All in around €2500 got me h22a7 type r engine, s80 type r gear box, Plm manifold and h2b kit, custom made exhaust and a map on Neptune by Vtec6000

 

[tobiasnugent]

I'll be looking to go the H2B route over christmas, after doing quite a bit of research its so much cheaper than a K without needing loads of specialists parts.

Ill be running a H22a7 with a morfspeed H2B kit(engine sits in the OEM position)

Bang for buck its a bargain. K will easily be nearly triple the cost. All though in the long run you could get more power out of the K than you could if you built the H but even then its more money.

 

[Karleg6]

I'd steer clear of the morfspeed kit.. I tried it out and it was a complete waste of time and money.. For an extra £100 you have a proper h2b kit. Not something butchered together in a garden shed..

 

[kulo]

I have h2b qsd kit for sale if anyones interested

 

[tobiasnugent]

I'd steer clear of the morfspeed kit.. I tried it out and it was a complete waste of time and money.. For an extra £100 you have a proper h2b kit. Not something butchered together in a garden shed..

I know your experience, ill be sticking with it.

 

[elchunk]

The bad side to a h-series is the gearbox. The torque of a 2.2 and a decent gearbox out of an itr would be cool.

 

[tobiasnugent]

Ill be using the ITR gearbox on my setup