why do japanese tuners stagger there wheels?


blinx9900

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i noticed most japanese ek9 tuners stagger there wheels using 15 rear with 195/55/15 tire and front with 16 using a 225/45/16 tire. why is this? i understand using a wider tire up front, a lot of US racers use 225/50/15 up front and 205/50/15 rear. but why do the japanese use a bigger wheel up front? i have guessed only a few reasons:

-looks?
-for bigger brakes?

someone please tell me!!!
 
I read that Japanese tuners do this to prevent over steer! And yes bigger brakes can also be and option.

This type of setup are very common in Hondas than in any other make, mostly ek9s, ek4s and eg6s :)
 
i agree with both of you, it is for traction/prevent understeer, but why dont they just put a 225 tire on a 15" wheel? why the need for a 16?
 
I think you're on the right track there blinx, more traction for accelleration, less understeer, and more options for bigger front brakes with more space for cooling with the 16" rim.
My other thoughts are- When they want to keep near the same final drive ratio (.3 mph difference @ 60mph) between two different rim sizes a 225/50 must be used with the 15", and a 225/45 with 16" wheel. Thats a side wall height difference of 11.25 millimeters, since more weight is transferred between the front wheels maybe they want to keep the shorter, stiffer, more responsive side wall. If they were to make their final drive slightly higher by going to the next smaller side wall height, using 225/40/16 and 225/45/15, the 15" tire's sidewall height is still 11.25 mm taller.
Since its better to have a bigger 7.5" or 8" wheel while running a wide 225 series tire for a stiffer more up and down path between side wall and bead, japanese tuners may find it easier or more cost effective to find a 16x8" wheel vs. a 15x8" wheel to use.
 
I think you're on the right track there blinx, more traction for accelleration, less understeer, and more options for bigger front brakes with more space for cooling with the 16" rim.
My other thoughts are- When they want to keep near the same final drive ratio (.3 mph difference @ 60mph) between two different rim sizes a 225/50 must be used with the 15", and a 225/45 with 16" wheel. Thats a side wall height difference of 11.25 millimeters, since more weight is transferred between the front wheels maybe they want to keep the shorter, stiffer, more responsive side wall. If they were to make their final drive slightly higher by going to the next smaller side wall height, using 225/40/16 and 225/45/15, the 15" tire's sidewall height is still 11.25 mm taller.
Since its better to have a bigger 7.5" or 8" wheel while running a wide 225 series tire for a stiffer more up and down path between side wall and bead, japanese tuners may find it easier or more cost effective to find a 16x8" wheel vs. a 15x8" wheel to use.

:nice: nice write up
 
I think you're on the right track there blinx, more traction for accelleration, less understeer, and more options for bigger front brakes with more space for cooling with the 16" rim.
My other thoughts are- When they want to keep near the same final drive ratio (.3 mph difference @ 60mph) between two different rim sizes a 225/50 must be used with the 15", and a 225/45 with 16" wheel. Thats a side wall height difference of 11.25 millimeters, since more weight is transferred between the front wheels maybe they want to keep the shorter, stiffer, more responsive side wall. If they were to make their final drive slightly higher by going to the next smaller side wall height, using 225/40/16 and 225/45/15, the 15" tire's sidewall height is still 11.25 mm taller.
Since its better to have a bigger 7.5" or 8" wheel while running a wide 225 series tire for a stiffer more up and down path between side wall and bead, japanese tuners may find it easier or more cost effective to find a 16x8" wheel vs. a 15x8" wheel to use.

sidewall deflection! i was thinking the same thing, and what you say about wheel size makes sense, last night i got to thinking perhaps its also for tire size?? maybe the tires they use are not available in 205/50/15?? who knows for sure :angry: but all the points so far are valid indeed :nice: thanks guys, now if only we can get mr spoon in here to give his opinion :clap:
 
i think the reason why they put 16" on the front and 15" on the back is for better weight distribution thus better handling.
If u compare and EK9 to a toyota corolla ae86 the corolla has 50/50 weight distribution.
Why beacause the rear wheels drive and the engine is at the front.
Whereas 9's have the engine at the front and the driving wheels. So the weight distribiution is more like 80/20. SO they are trying to push more weight to the back of the car to help it balance by putting 16 on the front

Not sure this is the prime reason but think balance has something to do with this......
 
i think the reason why they put 16" on the front and 15" on the back is for better weight distribution thus better handling.
If u compare and EK9 to a toyota corolla ae86 the corolla has 50/50 weight distribution.
Why beacause the rear wheels drive and the engine is at the front.
Whereas 9's have the engine at the front and the driving wheels. So the weight distribiution is more like 80/20. SO they are trying to push more weight to the back of the car to help it balance by putting 16 on the front

Not sure this is the prime reason but think balance has something to do with this......

with 16" up front your shifting the weight to the front even more, 16's are heavier. i dunno maybe i read this wrong?
 
i asked around a few other places, and i think i found an answer that im happy with:

"You'll notice with a 195/55 rear the sidewall is huge and it makes the lightly loaded rear end tires operate at very large slip angles making the tire have less grip but more predictability because the sidewalls are so flexible.

On the other hand, up front where you have most of the weight, the tires have a lot more load and need stiffer sidewalls (225/45) to operate at lower slip angles which improve grip and sharpen up the handling.

It's really a decent compromise because the sidewall height has a direct influence on the spring rate and response of the tire. " -ginsu2k
 
maybe...
wat i was saying was that say u put 20" on the front and 10" on the back. U would drive around and all the weight will be pushed to the back of the car as the front is lifted higher. the front wheel will have a larger radious than the rear so more distance between the rim and the centre of the wheel. This works on a smaller scale with 16" on the front and 15" on the back because the front is higher up more weight will be pushed towards the back of the car for more balance.
U r right the 16" wheel will be heavier on the front but only the wheel. The effect of putting this on will kind of angle the to have more downforce on the back. imagine u have a ruler and 4 coins (or circles) 2 larger and 2 slightly smaller. Put the larger ones on the front and the the others on the back and the weight and balance of the car will change=better balance=better weight distribution=better cornering.
hope u see wat im trying to say
 
maybe...
wat i was saying was that say u put 20" on the front and 10" on the back. U would drive around and all the weight will be pushed to the back of the car as the front is lifted higher. the front wheel will have a larger radious than the rear so more distance between the rim and the centre of the wheel. This works on a smaller scale with 16" on the front and 15" on the back because the front is higher up more weight will be pushed towards the back of the car for more balance.
U r right the 16" wheel will be heavier on the front but only the wheel. The effect of putting this on will kind of angle the to have more downforce on the back. imagine u have a ruler and 4 coins (or circles) 2 larger and 2 slightly smaller. Put the larger ones on the front and the the others on the back and the weight and balance of the car will change=better balance=better weight distribution=better cornering.
hope u see wat im trying to say

your forgetting 1 very important thing, coilovers, all those cars that have this setup have coilovers and the front is NOT higher than the back, that would be horrible for aerodynamics.
 
your forgetting 1 very important thing, coilovers, all those cars that have this setup have coilovers and the front is NOT higher than the back, that would be horrible for aerodynamics.


i agree...:nice:

any :pics: of examples would be brill... sure phaze has sme! :)
 
Will different sized wheels front to rear fail an MOT?
 
Will different sized wheels front to rear fail an MOT?

nope as long as the wheels are the same size on each axle its fine,it would fail if it had different sizes on the same axle though.
 
nope as long as the wheels are the same size on each axle its fine,it would fail if it had different sizes on the same axle though.

Any link to any website to confirm this?
 
He's right as long as the wheels AND the tyres are the same size on each axle then it will pass an mot

It will however fail an mot if the wheels stick out furhter than the body of he car like this..

33wnzmu.png
 
It will however fail an mot if the wheels stick out furhter than the body of he car like this..

No it won't, just an advisory that the wheels protrude the body of the car :secret:

My polo used to have a fair bit of poke on the wheels and was fine, that was getting mot'd at specialist cars
 
my car has 16s on the front and 15s on the back...would it be better for acceleration if i put the 15s on the front? for straight line acceleration??
 
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