mugen 26mm rear swaybar


rhdek9

outkast
Joined
Mar 3, 2007
Messages
46
does anyone in here have this swaybar on their ek9? i am curious as to if we need to put any kind of addition re-inforcement for the 26mm rear sway bar or if its okay to just bolt it on. i just basically want to make sure that i do not rip my rear subframe...
 
ek9 subframe is pretty rigid but if you want to be EXTRA safe you gan buy an ASR subframe brace. 26mm seems HUGE though.
 
i had one, and i didn't felt any difference so i decided to sell it. in my opinion if you use your car only for track only and have a roll cage, then you will need one of these,
 
SpoonCTR said:
i had one, and i didn't felt any difference so i decided to sell it. in my opinion if you use your car only for track only and have a roll cage, then you will need one of these,


u didn't feel any kind of difference between this and the stock 22mm? what spring rates are you running? i currently have a jdm itr 23mm rear sway, but i want the car to turn in a little bit more...
 
rhdek9 said:
u didn't feel any kind of difference between this and the stock 22mm? what spring rates are you running? i currently have a jdm itr 23mm rear sway, but i want the car to turn in a little bit more...

nope, none mate, F=16k R=12k spring rates..
 
SpoonCTR said:
nope, none mate, F=16k R=12k spring rates..


wow....interesting..hmm...i thought it would make a huge difference...hmm...
 
rhdek9 said:
wow....interesting..hmm...i thought it would make a huge difference...hmm...

hes running really stiff springs, im not surprised, thats porbably why almost no other company makes an after market rear bar for the ek9 thats bigger than stock, i think only cusco and mugen, asr used to have a 30mm but its been discontinued.


edit: i was wrong, the asr bar is NOT discontinued.
 
blinx9900 said:
hes running really stiff springs, im not surprised, thats porbably why almost no other company makes an after market rear bar for the ek9 thats bigger than stock, i think only cusco and mugen, asr used to have a 30mm but its been discontinued.


yea, i've been looking for the mugen 26mm, but until this day, i still can not find one. i'm actually thinking about getting the cusco one 25mm. do you think i will feel a difference? i currently have a 23mm rear sway with 600# rear springs ( i think that's either a 10k or 11k).
 
rhdek9 said:
i'm actually thinking about getting the cusco one 25mm. do you think i will feel a difference? i currently have a 23mm rear sway with 600# rear springs ( i think that's either a 10k or 11k).

i doubt it, stock is really big, there just isent that much weight in the back of the car that you need that big of a bar imo, you can try it out though, let us know how you like it.
 
blinx9900 said:
i doubt it, stock is really big, there just isent that much weight in the back of the car that you need that big of a bar imo, you can try it out though, let us know how you like it.

i totally agree, i think you can buy another thing that will benefit you more for the money! for example some carbon fiber mirrors! lol, you can loose a couple of pounds there hehehe :nerv:
 
its not about weight... its more about how fast you go, the radius of your turn and the suspension setting. Heres an example

If you have a car, settle for circuit, with stiffer shock, taking HIGH speed curves, obviously you will need a bigger sway bar, more force are pushing on the bar, and itf the bar isnt big enought it will bend.

If you are a car more for street/summer run/drag, u dont need OVERSIZED 30 mm swaybar, slighly bigger than factory's might be just what you need.

the point is, bragging that you have 30mm bar doesnt mean they are better than my 24mm... it all about your use

Note: if you dont know about this... having too much swaybars, and that arent well chosen sizewise might (HUUUUUGE in back and SMALL one at front can cause some oversteer, or understeer not sure)
 
The EK9 won't need any additional bracing. The mugen bar will simply cause the car to oversteer more, if that's what you feel you need.
 
Note: if you dont know about this... having too much swaybars, and that arent well chosen sizewise might (HUUUUUGE in back and SMALL one at front can cause some oversteer, or understeer not sure)

small or no sway bar in the front with a huge rear sway will induce a lot of rotation/oversteer.

it also depends on the track you run on. Spoon does not offer large sway bars because it goes against their theory in tuning...which is a car ought to change direction quickly.

a sway bar makes the independent suspension more "dependent" - think live axle. It's great for putting the power down and/or making the car corner in a more stable/flatter manner but it comes at the expense of sharper turn-in and the willingness to change directions upon driver input.

If you compare basic DC2/EG6 front bars and that of the DC2-R, you will see the DC2-R has a better pivot point that attaches to the front LCA. One would assume this enables it to have a more linear initial response making it more "pliable" until the bar is asked to do its job.

This is why cars with no front sway bars actually have a better initial turn-in...but that is completely overshadowed by a car with a front sway because it can and will corner faster .... of course this is a very broad over-generalization.
 
there are MUCH better ways to make your car turn in than a bigger rear ARB.......

are you running camber adjusters? EK9's seem to run alot more -ve camber on the rear than front after lowering which will obviously affect turn in. my car turns in pretty sharp currently but i'm sure after i sort the camber issues it will be even better!

also what like are your toe settings? i had mine set to zero toe on the front and 0.5 degree toe out on the rear, the additional toe out on the rear seems to swing the back round better :)
 
Is the mugen bar a solid one or not?if it is not this probably explains the reason why our friend didn't notice any major differeneces. The asr 24mm swaybar is a solid one. There is a 32mm kit which is for racing purposes, whereas this is a hollow one. A 32 hollow bar is something like 26mm solid bar.
 
I wonder why thick swaybars are used so often...

A swaybar makes the suspension on one side stiffer in the corners since the outer tire going into the arch will not only have to lift it's own spring but also a bit the one on the other side. Because it's linked to the suspension on the other side and in a corner that tire will not travel as far up as the other side. It does mean however, that the inner tire loses some of it's grip since it's lifted a bit by the swaybar that is pushed by the outer tire.

That way you can balance your car for under- or oversteer. But then why use such thick swaybars? Why not try to get your car in balance as you want with as thin a swaybar as possible? EG no swaybar in the front and a thin one at the rear? Cause the thing you get from swaybars besides being able to balance your car, is stiffer suspension for the outer tire. But that's something you can achieve by higher springrates. I'm somewhat puzzled by this. A guy I know that is building a Beemer M3 for trackdays is not even going to use a swaybar in the front...
 
as far as i can tell there is no magic formula that has a universal application to all cars, regarding the use of swaybars or not and moreover the thickness of them. So how are you able to decide whether you need a swaybar or not? Some basic principles and trial and error is something to begin with. My ej9 has front a swaybar (23mm) and no rear swaybar. As stock the handling was a nightmare, a lot of body roll, understeerish, and exteme leaning. When i lowered the car and placed some sporty shocks (HnR bilstein) it was a lot better, day and night i would say, but it lacked the pure sporty turn in, the sharp body moovement and agile handling in general. Of course there are always some key points that can give you the right touch, like harder bushings, more aggresive suspension angles etc apart from a set of shocks and springs. However i have always thought that the MUST of setting a honda suspension are the right R swaybars! I am about to find that out myself as in a few days i am going to install an ek9 front swaybar and the ASR kit for the rear. I think that if you already have a decent coilover set (not extreme spring rates) hard enough bushings and the R swaybar combo, you will come close to magic ek9 and dc2 handling!

some general facts that you have to take into consideration as fas as EK's are concerned are the body weight, the weight distribution masses which is mainly located to the front,and the agility of the frame which is needed in order to make the double wishbones work properly. So if you want to avoid swaybars you need to have extreme spring rates and way too low center of gravity, meaningly low body. You can easily understand that these facts would compromise road use and comfort. So swaybars give you the opportunity for more street oriented spring rates and not extreme lowering. However this a general comment and i cannot prove it with mere numbers. So i would take as an orientation the R spec suspension set up and move from there!!
 
Well, I understand what you mean. But what I wonder is how much extra springrate you need to have the same amount of resistance. If it would only be, like 10% stiffer springs then I think it's better to use no swaybars as you can reach the same effects without the swaybar. It would be a little bit less comfortable, but your suspension stays independent and that should give extra grip. But I don't know how much stiffer springs need to be when taking of a swaybar.
 
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